12-17-2023, 12:30 AM
(12-16-2023, 09:32 AM)Celarious Wrote: Pretty sure rewards were removed because they were never actually used for their intended purpose, Haxus mentioned they were just abused so emperors could give themselves infinite free money http://www.hazeron.com/mybb/showthread.p...s#pid10305
There's also the problem that money isn't actually useful at all anymore, there's no research to spend it on, once you buy your EV suit and gun then that's it, and I'm pretty sure yuri gagarin gives you an EV suit if you do rocket training so
In addition, there's also no "progression towards a larger ship", all you need to do is find a basic shuttle in your starting city, fly to a random habitable, colonize it, boom, now you're an emperor again doing emperor things again, unless you specifically restrict yourself to existing cities only, but then there's nothing to do once you get a big ship, colonization (and thus becoming an emperor again) is really the only gameplay, there's nobody and nothing to fight...
Also only sticking to existing cities relies on you intentionally setting up infrastructure to support "company ships" like private security contractors and however crew are recruited
And everything else that exists for citizen players technically only still does as leftovers from the MMO, when you could start the game by joining random players' empires
Maybe if the NPC empires allow us to join under them then this style of play could become more prevalent, but currently the systems in place for it are purely for self-RP and don't really work in a singleplayer environment, unless you really really really really like solo RP I guess
It would be cool if MP returns but that may not happen anytime soon given Haxus chose to prioritize NPC empires first
The main reason for starting this thread was that it bothered me I could no longer load citizens int a SUV or space transport. But then it got me thinking of other things also.
I could be wrong, but iirc you couldn't enter or take control of ships unless you were in the chain of command of a city before. Maybe that was only for officered ships.
Either way it could be made impossible for citizen players to acquire empire ships, the same way a US citizen can not go and take command for a US navy aircraft carrier for starting his ow shipping company.
Money has no use? Well yeah I'm exactly trying to give it a use. Otherwise you might abolish money aswell. Just take everything for free. I'm suggesting to add options that were removed, which I personally liked. Sure the rewards could be abused to get infinite money (corruption), but then why remove them to just be able to get infinite money? Could have just left it in. Basically before we had the ability to have government corruption in addtion to having the "decent government" gameplay option (giving goverment members reasonable rewards for their efforts) and the ability to give citizens rewards. Now we just have absolute government corruption without a "decent" option and no ability to give citizens rewards.
So the reasoning seemingly was: because corrupt politicians (players) exist, we don't need checks and balances anymore, we should just embrace corruption and citizens don't need to make money for public service, but will get free aircraft carriers instead. Free aircraft carriers for everyone!
But if that is the preference of the majority, then so be it.
Free aircraft carriers for everyone sounds cool actually. Hmm, maybe I'd vote for that guy too. Ffs I'm a communist or at least anti-monetarist and am trying to get capitalism and monetarism in the game, SMH. Capitalism is an addictive mmo triggering lots of dopamine releases, it seems. That's probably why we keep it around. Whole world seems addicted to it.
I had written an entire off topic section rambing about fixed prices RL economics, artificial scarcity and fractional reserve banking, flawed/circular logic used as justification, and suggesting an alternative, but maybe such things don't belong here. Also I wasted 2 hours writing it. Either way it made me conclude the current hazeron system is actually realistic when you are able to collect infinite resources.
Without money as a restricting factor, once we have several planets worth of resources an economy of abundance like Hazeron could be possible. (not per planet ofcourse). We have only mined a fraction of the Earth's minerals anyway. The problem is perhaps rather technology and water, fertile land and pollution/destroying biodiversity, but doing so outside our homeplanet on perhaps orbital farms would be fine.
Idea: Because the number of planets is virtually infinite anyway , maybe each planet could have a (very large) maximum number of each mineral (depending on mineral percentages).
Potential (difficult to implement) solution: Maybe goverments could have restricted budgets. Maybe some expenses should be added. Maybe printing infinite money could inflate prices to the point it is not useful (but without a delay, unlike IRL, for easier implementation), unless the money supply grows in accordance to the population and production growth. Ofcourse that would be a huge change to the way the Hazeron economy works and is likely not going to happenin the short term.
People play entire games where their only goal is to buy a bigger ship, to make more money to buy an even bigger ship. Some games like X4 allow you to have a fleet and eventually build some kind of empire. I just thought it would be neat to have that option in Hazeron. Ok others disagree, so not happening. Fine. I guess I can pretend by giving rewards to the citizen with my emperor character, but that kind feels less immersive than before. Go communism! Free aircraft carriers!
About joining the AI empires as a citizen, I completely agree, was even thinking about that after posting it last night. You could work your way up until you reach a certain rank and then either stay loyal or leave and found your own empire (like M&B Warband) or perhaps even overthrow the emperor and take his place.
I've left in the the striken parts because I consider 2 possible realities: one where capitalism exists and one where it doesn't.
Ok I'll stay away from the forums for a while. :D