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+--- Thread: 2020-10-06 Shores of Hazeron Moving to Steam (/showthread.php?tid=2491)
RE: 2020-10-06 Shores of Hazeron Moving to Steam - Rockinsince87 - 10-08-2020
(10-08-2020, 12:24 PM)AnrDaemon Wrote:(10-07-2020, 07:31 PM)Rockinsince87 Wrote: Haxus are you prepared to grow Hazeron fast? Hire more people to maintain the servers while you focus on development. Is hazeron scalable to that degree? Regional server farms? EDIT: Different galaxy = different region?
The game is inherently scalable. On universe level. The problem is scaling within solarsystem.
That's what I was thinking. One master server and 25 workers. How many workers can a master manage, and what's the actual capacity of the worker servers. Those are valid questions that need answering. If Haxus sells 50,000 copies let's say, how many servers are required? 500? if we assume 100 players for 25 workers?
Here is the next question, is the database distributed across the workers so each worker locally processes transactions? or is it stored on the master only? Meaning, can the database handle the massive increase in transactions as the player base scales? Depending on the architecture this could be a major bottle kneck.
RE: 2020-10-06 Shores of Hazeron Moving to Steam - AnrDaemon - 10-08-2020
One master recorded to manage 40+ workers. The code can run in multimaster mode. But that's not the problem. Problem is how many people could be handled IN THE SAME SOLARSYSTEM.
RE: 2020-10-06 Shores of Hazeron Moving to Steam - Rockinsince87 - 10-08-2020
(10-08-2020, 02:33 PM)AnrDaemon Wrote: One master recorded to manage 40+ workers. The code can run in multimaster mode. But that's not the problem. Problem is how many people could be handled IN THE SAME SOLARSYSTEM.
Yeah, I remember when there were 45 workers. Multimaster also takes care of that issue overall so that's good to know. The solar system multi-user/ship count is an issue, fleet battles are laggy like crazy. However that "should" be easy to fix with better server hardware. Multi-socket with very large core/thread count. If the resources are dynamic (it seems that way) then let solar systems consume threads as needed to handle the load and return the resources when done.
It would be nice if Hazeron can use gpu core/threads for processing, which could help control server hardware costs. Graphics cards are much cheaper than processors' prices to performance-wise.
RE: 2020-10-06 Shores of Hazeron Moving to Steam - resonkinetic - 10-08-2020
(10-07-2020, 07:31 PM)Rockinsince87 Wrote: what if Hazeron takes off like crazy. Like does REALLY REALLY well on Steam.
It's a niche game with niche mechanics and niche graphics. It's going to get hammered by most people because "muh grafix" then anyone who appreciates it for what it is will be turned off when Haxus goes back to a subscription model.
Still, even after all of that there's going to be a net positive. I'm not sure it's going to be enough to keep Haxus working on the game, however.
RE: 2020-10-06 Shores of Hazeron Moving to Steam - Rockinsince87 - 10-08-2020
(10-08-2020, 07:46 PM)resonkinetic Wrote:(10-07-2020, 07:31 PM)Rockinsince87 Wrote: what if Hazeron takes off like crazy. Like does REALLY REALLY well on Steam.
It's a niche game with niche mechanics and niche graphics. It's going to get hammered by most people because "muh grafix" then anyone who appreciates it for what it is will be turned off when Haxus goes back to a subscription model.
Still, even after all of that there's going to be a net positive. I'm not sure it's going to be enough to keep Haxus working on the game, however.
I agree with you 100%. It will hook those who don't care about the graphics (which are really not that awful, to be honest, and can be improved ((look at what is going on with minecraft these days))). If the price is not right and the total cost of ownership is too high then Hazeron is back to square one.
Personally, I feel that Hazeron will get picked up by a decent number of players. Most current players stumbled upon it, there was no advertisement. If he is able to sell let's say 50,000 copies and there is a yearly fee of 10 USD, that might just work. The key to a low yearly subscription fee is a larger volume of sales and a low total cost of ownership. There are a few ways to figure that out but it's all actuary based finance so the more information gathered the more accurate the prediction.
RE: 2020-10-06 Shores of Hazeron Moving to Steam - Kosgev - 10-08-2020
I would keep the Patreon in any case and as well keep the current Universe.
Also login and usage should be able independently from the steam UI being active.
RE: 2020-10-06 Shores of Hazeron Moving to Steam - AnrDaemon - 10-09-2020
(10-08-2020, 03:27 PM)Rockinsince87 Wrote: The solar system multi-user/ship count is an issue, fleet battles are laggy like crazy. However that "should" be easy to fix with better server hardware.Not all issues could be solved with more hardware.
See EVE's "Jita syndrome" f.e. The more hardware you drop at a single most demanded system in the universe, the more people are going to use it, thus increasing demand to the limits, whatever the limits to be.
Quote:Multi-socket with very large core/thread count.No matter how many cores/threads are there, one solarsystem is handled by one thread.
Compare it with bipedal walking - you can't have left leg handled by a brain different from the one handling the right leg. Or you get anything but smooth walking.
RE: 2020-10-06 Shores of Hazeron Moving to Steam - GaelicVigil - 10-09-2020
I'm a new player, only started after the game went free to play a short time ago. I think putting this on Steam is a good idea and I would gladly pay $25 for it. I think one time payments are the new business models for games like this, and they seem to work well for a lot of games - large and small. But I would also suggest keeping Patreon up for the perks for those hardcore supporters who really want to help the game grow.
And most importantly: PLEASE DO NOT WIPE THE UNIVERSE!
RE: 2020-10-06 Shores of Hazeron Moving to Steam - Rockinsince87 - 10-09-2020
(10-09-2020, 02:40 PM)AnrDaemon Wrote:(10-08-2020, 03:27 PM)Rockinsince87 Wrote: The solar system multi-user/ship count is an issue, fleet battles are laggy like crazy. However that "should" be easy to fix with better server hardware.Not all issues could be solved with more hardware.
See EVE's "Jita syndrome" f.e. The more hardware you drop at a single most demanded system in the universe, the more people are going to use it, thus increasing demand to the limits, whatever the limits to be.
Quote:Multi-socket with very large core/thread count.No matter how many cores/threads are there, one solarsystem is handled by one thread.
Compare it with bipedal walking - you can't have left leg handled by a brain different from the one handling the right leg. Or you get anything but smooth walking.
Of course adding more hardware to non-optimized systems wont really solve anything long term, I agree 100% with you on that. I don't know what the current server hardware is today, I'm hoping it's changed since https://www.hazeron.com/ComputerCenter.html
If it has not changed and that above web link is correct, I standby my previous statements to improve server and storage hardware.
As for the solar systems are concerned, I mentioned that should be overhauled to allow more threads on demand based on thread load. I know none of that is easy to do but it must be done to handle the big leagues.
RE: 2020-10-06 Shores of Hazeron Moving to Steam - QuakeIV - 10-09-2020
Its fucked anyways, if we need to pay 25 to get in then a lot of people wont pay that and then player count in the already empty universe goes down even further.